In this episode, Teddy talks with a client about the open ended soil remediation process.
Questions Asked…..
- Any extras that will make the invoice higher then the quote? 35 sec
- What happens if job takes longer then one day? 2:15
- What would be the additional fees if you have to come another day to finish? 4:30
- Is there a way to cap the costs of remediation? 6:00
- If we stop the remediation, can we finish it one year later? 7:40
- Is the $400 NJDEP review fee in addition to the quoted price? 9:00
- If we do not finish the job, are we still responsible for the remedial action report? 9:30
Transcript….
Intro:
Welcome to Tank Talk With Teddy, a podcast talking all things related to residential oil tanks. You have questions, Teddy has answers.
Customer:
Hey, Teddy. How are you?
Teddy:
I’m good. I’m good. I got your email. So yeah, I wanted to just kind of go through that with you. Do you have a second?
Customer:
All right. I’m sorry. Yes, go ahead.
Teddy:
Okay, let me just pull that email up, and see the questions that you had. Let me see, where is that email?
Customer:
Yeah, so I can just walk you through it. So the first question that I have, yesterday we talked about what would happen if it goes over 20 tons
and you mentioned that the variable costs will be the exportation of the contaminated soil, and the clean fill material. But I just wondered if there
was anything else that will increase the cost of the quote by unit, any other variables that will make it higher, than-
Teddy:
Yeah. So there were three line items that we have to be concerned about if we go over 30 tons of soil. So the first one would be the waste classification sample.
So that’s going to increase an additional $600. That’s what the facility charges to bring in additional soil, over 30 tons. It’s a one-time charge. So, I mean, you could go up to 500 tons and there’s no additional fees, but if it’s over 30, they will charge us that additional fee. So that’s one variable.
And then the two other variables is the soil disposal at $75 a ton, and then the clean fill at $25 per ton.
Teddy:
So whatever that tonnage is, if it’s 40 tons, we’re going to bill you for that exact tonnage for removal and replacement.
Customer:
Got it. Okay. So I should say, it would be like an additional 600, so it would be like a total of 1095?
Teddy:
Exactly. Exactly. Yep.
Customer:
Okay.
Customer:
And so, and I noticed for example, like all of the costs of the excavator and the trucks and everything, I assume that’s for the day, right?
Customer:
So what happens [crosstalk 00:02:11] if you have to go to, if this takes more than one day? Would that be like an additional cost of all that? Or that’s all for the job?
Teddy:
No. Yeah. The open-ended contract is time and material. I could tell you that about 90% of our jobs, we finish in one day, it’s very rare that we have to return for a second day, or a third day.
I mean, it does happen, but it is very unusual and we are capable of removing … and this is a question that is a good question, because there’s some companies
that what they do is they mobilize with really small equipment. So they can only take out, let’s say, 30 or 40 tons of soil in a day. And then they want to charge you for a second and third day.
We don’t operate like that. We’ve mobilized to your house. We have the capabilities of moving, depending on the access, anywhere between a hundred to 150 tons in one day, if we have to.
Teddy:
Obviously, we’re not taking that out if we don’t have to, but we have the capabilities of doing that amount of soil in one day, which is really a lot of soil.
Customer:
Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
Teddy:
Yeah. We’re not looking to milk a job and have it run into a second or third day, that’s the last thing we’re trying to do. And our guys work from basically 7:00 AM till seven, eight o’clock at night, to sun down.
And a lot of companies, again, same thing, two o’clock comes around … “No, we’re eight hours, we’re leaving. We’re going to come back tomorrow.” We don’t play that game.
We work until basically the facilities shutdown, which is about 4:30, five o’clock and then we could be on site for another two hours finishing up.
Customer:
Okay. Got it. So basically what you’re saying is that the 8500 quote is really for one day of work, for 20 tons. And then it will increase depending on the tons of soil that you take out,
and the [inaudible 00:04:01], but then if it takes up to 150 tons to take out in that one day, all of our costs remain the same.
Teddy:
Exactly. [crosstalk 00:04:11]. The only variable that will be is the soil itself. That would be the only variable cost in that. Yeah, exactly. So, yeah. And then if it does so happen that we
wind up pulling a hundred and something tons, and we have to come back to backfill or something, then there’ll be some additional fees for the equipment and the labor.
Customer:
And what would be those fees?
Teddy:
You’re looking at, again, it depends. If we’re just back filling the hole, let’s say we got all the contamination out the first day, and it winds up being a hundred and something tons,
and we have to come back to backfill, well, we’re not charging you for subsurface evaluator, because he’s the guy who does all the samples. So that would have been done the first day.
You would have a field foreman, an environmental technician, you would have the service truck, you’d have the excavator, those line items.
Customer:
Okay. Got it. So basically everything, the excavators, [inaudible 00:05:06], the field vehicle. Okay. All right.
Teddy:
And again, it’s very rare. I mean, and we’ll know by 11 o’clock the day we come out to do it, but typically by 11, 11:30, we know how extensive it’s going to be. Majority of the time,
we get all the contamination out by noon, and then the afternoon we’re filling in the excavation. We’re done.
Customer:
Yeah. No, no, I get it. I’m just trying to prepare for what a worst case scenario, hopefully that doesn’t actually happen, you know?
Teddy:
Absolutely. I get it.
Customer:
So the other thing is that, in the very rare case, hopefully this doesn’t happen, that this is looking to be over a hundred tons of soil, depending on how you guys are looking at that,
because we have a budget for this, right?
Customer:
So like, the 8500 is really just about the top of what we can actually afford to spend on this. So like, if it goes for another $2000, or something like that, I mean, that’s doable.
But if he goes way above that, it will be hard for us to be able to cover that. Is there any way that we can assess the tonnage that you guys are taking in, be able to like stop at some point,
if it goes beyond something that we’re able to actually cover? Or pay for?
Teddy:
Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So here’s the thing, so if you say to me, “Okay, Teddy, I got, $10,000 is the absolute max,” and let’s say that’s 40 tons of soil, whatever that calculation comes out to,
which is roughly about two truckloads of soil.
Teddy:
So if I know that, once we get to that point on the job, let’s say I’m out there and we get the one truck out and we say, “Oh, you know what? It still looks kind of dirty.”
But we make a decision together on site. Do you want to take another truckload out? And you agree because you see the soil, you smell it, the geologist on site says that we should.
So we take out that second truck. But now you’re telling me, “Okay, I’m maxed out. I don’t have any more funds.” So we can sample the excavation at that point and backfill the hole, finish all the site work.
Teddy:
Now, even though those samples are going to have an odor to it, because obviously, I mean, unless they’re clean, and obviously we know it’s finished. But if it’s not,
we could still stop the job and say, “All right, let’s take the samples anyways, and then just backfill the hole.” Let’s see what those lab results are, because even if it’s contaminated,
as long as it’s under the level of acceptable limits, we can close it out. And we could absolutely stop the drop at that point.
Teddy:
Now, I can’t guarantee that those samples are going to be clean and you’re going to pass.
Customer:
Yeah.
Teddy:
But we can stop the job at that point. Absolutely.
Customer:
Yeah, exactly. So what I was wondering, because I want to get this done, but obviously I don’t want this to be like a $20,000 job, because I don’t think we can afford that.
But what I would say is that I would want to be able to say, okay, if we at some point realized that it’s going to go above where I want to pay, stop it at that point, and maybe we
can finish it up in a year or two years from now. Is that something that is possible?
Teddy:
A hundred percent. 100%. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, hopefully, again, I mean, I’ve had this happen in the past where customer tells me, “I have a limit,” and we stop and we take our
samples, even though they’re dirty and they come back and they’re a pass, and they’re under the limit. And then the client’s finished, a hundred percent. So that’s capable.
Now, let’s say worst case they don’t pass. Yeah, you’re not under any kind of timeframe where you have to then finish it in a certain timeframe.
Teddy:
You could tell me, “Hey, Teddy, I got to save up some money when I have another couple thousand dollars to complete it, I’ll let you know. And the thing is, at that point,
let’s say those five or six samples comes back and only one of them is over the limits. Well, I’ll be able to come back to you and tell you, “Hey, we only have one area that we have to dig out,
it’s this one sidewall. So here’s the estimate to do that, to come back.” And at least you’ll have an idea of what that additional cost is going to be, and then you can determine on when you’re going to have us come out.
Customer:
Yeah. That makes sense. That makes sense. Okay, great. I think … oh yeah, and the other question that I had is the 400 check to the treasurer, so that’s on top of the $500 prep fee, right?
Teddy:
Yes. That’s a separate check that at the end of the project, you’re going to cut a check directly to the Treasurer, state of New Jersey.
You’re not going to send it to them, you’re going to give it to us. We’re going to attach it to your report, and we’re going to send that to the state once the project is a hundred percent complete.
So until that report is finished and we’re a hundred percent ready to submit it, to ask them for an NFA, that check is not due. So don’t send them any money.
Don’t do anything until the final report is done, and then we’ll tell you what the process is from there.
Customer:
Okay. So that’s actually, that’s another question. If for whatever reason, we don’t happen to finish the job this time around because it goes above with what we’re able to pay.
So all have these fees around the action reports and everything, doesn’t take place, right? Because that only happens when it’s done?
Teddy:
Exactly. Yep. Yeah. So you can hold back that money. So, initially how it works is the 50% deposit, so we take that 50% deposit, we schedule you, we come out, we do the work.
If there’s a situation where one of those samples is not clean, and you tell me, “Hey, I can’t finish this,” then yeah, you can pay the balance minus the report and reporting fees. Yeah, absolutely. 100%.
Customer:
Okay. That makes sense.
Teddy:
All right?
Customer:
All right, Teddy. Thank you so much for the information. I really appreciate you taking the time to walk me through this. I’m going to- [crosstalk 00:10:36].
Teddy:
Yeah, man. Any other questions, you let me know. I mean, we’re scheduling about a week and a half out right now. So as soon as you give us the green light, I’ll get you scheduled in right away.
Customer:
Okay. Sounds good. Thank you so much.
Teddy:
Thank you, sir.
Customer:
Have a good day.
Teddy:
You too.